From: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org (alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest) To: ammf-digest@smoe.org Subject: alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V3 #525 Reply-To: ammf@fruvous.com Sender: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest Saturday, June 26 1999 Volume 03 : Number 525 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Pardon my ignorance... [trace@frumail.org (Trace)] re: huh? [FruKid ] Re: total request live + Moxy ["KatieWow" ] re: IWHO debate [Taryn Chase ] Re: The Vault show! (very long) [fruwench@aol.com (FruWench)] Re: Review: 6-24-99, The Vault (Long long long) [srm9988n@aol.composter (] Rams Head dreamin' begins [bbwminors@aol.com (BBWMinors)] Re: OMG! GUSTER!!! [Gruneberg Veronica J <6vjg@qlink.queensu.ca>] total request live + Moxy [truztno1 ] Re: Pardon my ignorance... [ravenheart@ravens.org (Raven (#4337 of 45000 ] Re: total request live + Moxy [truztno1 ] Re: Rams Head dreamin' begins [Swoop-Dot-Loop ] The Vault =) [Amanda.K.Potter@Dartmouth.EDU (Amanda K. Potter)] Re: total request live + Moxy [Chad Maloney ] Re: The Vault show! (very long) [srm9988n@aol.composter (Lori Martin)] Re: huh? [jkpolk@ntplx.net (Andrea Krause)] re: stanley cup lamentations [CheesemonkeyGem ] Re: The Vault show! (very long) [Chad Maloney ] Re: The Vault show! (very long) [Modnar ] The Vault- 6-24-99 [trace@frumail.org (Trace)] Re: the great IWHO debate continues. ;) [srm9988n@aol.composter (Lori Mar] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 15:55:41 GMT From: trace@frumail.org (Trace) Subject: Re: Pardon my ignorance... On Fri, 25 Jun 1999 15:09:05 GMT, ravenheart@ravens.org (Raven (#4337 of 45000 - collect them all)) wrote: >Immediately after the show at the Vault in Baltimore last night, there >was played on the sound system a kind of techno-fied remix of King of >Spain. Can anyone tell me what that's from/how I could get a copy of >it? Oh goodness, we all left that out of our reviews. That was the Dance Mix King of Spain, which was mixed by Cal's brother. Cal Stanutz is Fruvous' sound engineer in case you weren't aware. It has never been officially released, and only exists on a few show bootlegs. Pretty cool eh? :) - -- Trace trace@frumail.org AMM-F: You must be this insane to ride ----- - -Veronica J Gruneberg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 14:32:22 GMT From: FruKid Subject: re: huh? Ronnie said: > Bleah. Starbuck's coffee is *awful*!! Gross, gross, gross!! Even though I'm pretty involved in this discussion already, but I'd like to point out that I don't like coffee at all. Frankly, I think it's nasty stuff and it tastes like burnt dirt mixed with boiling water, no matter where the dirt came from or whether it's hazelnut mocha dirt or not. Coffee ice cream or cappucinos with a lot of sugar (unfrozen coffee ice cream, really =)) are the only goodcoffeethings to me. I guess I don't need the caffiene or anything, so it makes coffee pointless. So, I'm right with Ronnie that starbucks coffee tastes awful. For a totally different reason. =D FruKid Was that a really stupid thing to say? Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 15:42:05 -0400 From: "KatieWow" Subject: Re: total request live + Moxy it sounds really cool, but in all honesty, i have a couple questions/concerns: 1) does MTV even *have* copies of any of the videos? 2) it doesn't work. after the infamous new kids on the block internet rally, every fan group of every band attempted to do the same thing. sudden onslaughts of requests for seldom (okay, never) -played material aren't going to get that material on TV. it was cute once, but MTV is wise to it now (and were probably wise to it the whole time it was happening). ~~kate - -- Kate Leahy kleahy@loyola.edu katiewow@frumail.org ***************************************************************** "Quite frankly, I wish the website would just go down . . . we're starting to make a little bit of money. It's a disaster." "We're about the music." - --The guys, West Coast Live **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 13:35:00 GMT From: Taryn Chase Subject: re: IWHO debate in thinking about the parallels pointed out: I found this tidbit at the www.stingchronicity.co.uk site... "If You Love Somebody Set Them Free was written as an antidote to the song Every Breath You Take. Every Breath You Take was about obsessive surveillance of a loved one to the point of paranoia. I wanted to write a song that was the opposite. But both songs are kind of ambiguous because Every Breath You Take has a kind of seductive and romantic side to it which a lot of people responded to. A lot of people think it's their song. I don't know what kind of relationships they have but to me it's a very dark song. And some other people would find If You Love Somebody Set Them Free quite sinister. But I enjoy that. It's whatever you make of it." ---All This Time CD-ROM, '95 Hey, maybe Jian will come out with a similar "antidote" song... when (notice I didn't say if) he gets tired of being asked if it's *really* a love song. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jun 1999 01:02:49 GMT From: fruwench@aol.com (FruWench) Subject: Re: The Vault show! (very long) Yay! I made it into Lori's babble list!! I wanted to make the Pre-Vault dinner and am VERY sorry I missed meeting everyone. Hopefully at another show I'll be more together. I apologize that this isn't a review. I have to admit to not being able to give one. A couple songs hit me pretty hard due to some life crisises going on about now. But I expected that. I'm working on three hours sleep, giving me a grand total of about 12 since Sunday - wheeeee. But I did enjoy the show. A friend of mine said that the Psycho Killer heckler was also heckling the Ram's Head or Birchmere show last time, I forget which. But that means he may be back *insert dramatic music here* Damn, I'm rambling. Ok - everyone say "go away ladywench" Bye ladywench FruSpace - We came, we saw, we slept on the floor . . . "For we can still love the world, who find a famished kitten on the step and know recesses for it from the fury of the street" - Hart Crane "Chaplinesque" ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 1999 22:30:13 GMT From: srm9988n@aol.composter (Lori Martin) Subject: Re: Review: 6-24-99, The Vault (Long long long) Amanda/koogle wrote: and i just want to mention that her alleged "snappishness" was *not* a problem! I thought, rather, she just stated her own comfort zone clearly and unabrasively. I wish I had the same guts sometimes (like, especially with smoke-ring-blowing-boy during Dave Tieff's set.) Backpacks are a *good* space-enforcer at standing shows. Thanks for the tip, Nafs! As for the crowd, yeah they were noisy as hell, and annoyed a lot of us in the first few rows -- that kind of crap during a song like MPG is particularly grating. I felt bad that what started out as an energy-filled, rocking night for the guys became so filled with annoyances from the audience. They gave a good, technically tight show, but you could tell it really bothered them, especially during the last half. I wish people who want to go out for a night of chatter with friends would go someplace other than a *concert*. Sheesh. - -- Lori ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 1999 19:10:26 GMT From: bbwminors@aol.com (BBWMinors) Subject: Rams Head dreamin' begins Well, even though I didn't get to participate in the "Friends of the band seats at OC' thread, I can start the "I got my seats for Rams Head" thread ... and I didn't even know they had reserved seating! Figured it was just wait at the door and hang at Stage Mur for three hours. But no, apparently tix went on sale yesterday and my call there this morning from my road trip (currently in Toledo for the second time in a week) brought me (drum roll please) Table 105, second row center (granted that's probably stage microphone in our face with our luck). Would Tables 104 and 106 chime in please??? We've also gotten 6 p.m. dinner resverations in the tavern (comes with discount, free brewskie and validated parking) so come look for us there!!!!!! OK, OK, don't look yet -- it's not till August 18. But I can dream can't I? Something to make coming home from vacation less of a bummer -- I'll be the one with the Hawaiian tan and the empty bank account, sitting with FruChild (plus our guests). Officially ticketed Queen Lisa. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 1999 16:36:48 GMT From: Gruneberg Veronica J <6vjg@qlink.queensu.ca> Subject: Re: OMG! GUSTER!!! Hmm... now I'm hoping I make it to the Stardust picnic in enough time to hear them tonight. Stupid work. Stupid train. :) Ah well, as long as I get to hear Blue Rodeo and GBS I'll be a happy camper. And if the concert finished in enough time for me to get to the Wellington (the pub that my friend who was the doorman ushered a few FruLads out the door at closing time with his famous "I don't care who you are. You ain't gotta go home, but you gotta get the hell outta here!" line which I have been on the receiving end of more than once) I will be positively ecstatic! :) Veronica (hour and a half 'till I can start getting ready to leave!) - -- *************************************************************************** "Never look at the trombones, | Veronica Gruneberg it only encourages them." | Dept. of Biology - Richard Strauss | Queen's University | Kingston, Ontario | ICQ#: 38114574 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 13:41:14 -0400 From: truztno1 Subject: total request live + Moxy i know you guys have probably discussed this to death before i joined this NG, but I was just thinking, wouldn't it be really kick-ass if we got a Fruvous video (if they have one) on to MTV's total request live? for those of you who have no idea what it is, it's a show on MTV where the viewers request videos, and the ten that are requested the most are shown. i'm pretty sure if we spread this to all frufans/heads, we could pull it off. i know some people probably don't want this to happen because they're afraid it'll disrupt the small, close-knit fruvous community, but i was just thinking, just once, wouldn't it be really cool if we all requested it through their website on august 10 in honor of the release of Thornhill? ok, sorry if i'm being ignorant because there is no Fruvous video and as a NG, you've made a general consensus that this is the exact thing that you DON'T want happening, but i had to share that little lightbulb of an idea. ~truztno1 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 16:54:48 GMT From: ravenheart@ravens.org (Raven (#4337 of 45000 - collect them all)) Subject: Re: Pardon my ignorance... On Fri, 25 Jun 1999 15:55:41 GMT, trace@frumail.org (Trace) wrote: >On Fri, 25 Jun 1999 15:09:05 GMT, ravenheart@ravens.org (Raven (#4337 >of 45000 - collect them all)) wrote: > >>Immediately after the show at the Vault in Baltimore last night, there >>was played on the sound system a kind of techno-fied remix of King of >>Spain. Can anyone tell me what that's from/how I could get a copy of >>it? > >Oh goodness, we all left that out of our reviews. That was the Dance >Mix King of Spain, which was mixed by Cal's brother. Cal Stanutz is >Fruvous' sound engineer in case you weren't aware. It has never been >officially released, and only exists on a few show bootlegs. Pretty >cool eh? :) > >-- >Trace >trace@frumail.org > >AMM-F: You must be this insane to ride ----- >-Veronica J Gruneberg Yer, it sounded very cool. Que lastima. Thanks for the info Trace. - -Raven 4337 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 17:04:55 -0400 From: truztno1 Subject: Re: total request live + Moxy mmmm...... good point, but i don't see any harm in trying. it's pretty unrealistic, but if we got ALL fruvous fans (not only people in the U.S, but literally everybody) wouldn't we hit the +1,000 vote mark? after all, TRL is done on the web. and as tacky and idiotic as the whole MTV channel may currently be, i just think it would be pretty funny if that many people did vote on the same day and left some people at MTV going "who the hell is this moxy fruvous and their vicious fans?" who knows, maybe we'll convert a few people into fruvous fans. i consider that in itself a good thing. sort of. maybe. i don't know, i'm kinda rambling here, so i'll shut up now. ~truztno1 (whose head is apparently getting affected by the heat and is reaching over for the AC button) _______________________________________________________________ friend: what are you listening to? me: moxy fruvous. friend: what? me: (pronouncing very slowly) mmoooxxxxyyyyyy fruuuuuuvoouuusss. friend: nevermind. cool. : ) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 22:52:28 GMT From: Swoop-Dot-Loop Subject: Re: Rams Head dreamin' begins In article <7l0q3p$fap$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, Ellen Ellen Watermelon wrote: > In article <19990625151026.28989.00003898@ng-cj1.aol.com>, > bbwminors@aol.com (BBWMinors) wrote: > > Table 105, second > > row center (granted that's probably stage microphone in our face > > with our luck). Would Tables 104 and 106 chime in please??? > > i'm at 106. And I've already requested space at 106. I'm also hoping for for an actual DC area show--either at the 9:30 or the Birchmere--on Tuesday or Thursday. Jian dropped a hint that they'd be back in "the DC area" soon. A girl can hope, can't she? Speaking of which, I just realized that the Phila Folk Fest is as close to my one-year anniversary of Fruvous shows as I'm going to get. I guess I *have* to go. - --Amanda, twist my arm a little more "Science won't change you, religion won't change you, what's the matter with you?" Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 14:09:58 GMT From: Amanda.K.Potter@Dartmouth.EDU (Amanda K. Potter) Subject: The Vault =) Well, Lawrence did a really great job of reviewing the show, so I won't go into great detail explaining the wonderful time I had last night. But I thought I'd share a bit anyway... My personal favorite moment during the show was when Murray revealed to the audience that Jian spends his off-days in front of the hotel room TV, trying to learn Ricky Martin's dance moves. :-) I think Jian could beat Ricky in a dance contest any day. Jian then discussed the possibility of fame and fortune for Moxy Fruvous if one of them were to die before the album came out. "Maybe we'd rise to number 4 in the charts!" he said, while making reference to memorial Sting covers. ("As I walk in fields of barley") :o) Then someone, Mike, I think, said that they could replace the dead member with an ex-member of Menuto (my apologies- I have no idea how to spell that!)to which Murray replied, "I think they've formed a union of ex-Menuto members- local 141." =) The show was truly wonderful and I'm so happy that I could be there. Hi to Lizzie, Katie, and Lori, and all of the other Fruheads I was finally brave enough to introduce myself to last night. I promise I'll post more and I can't wait to see you all at Fal con Ridge! - -Amanda "We're like dogs jumping through flaming hoops."- Murray, 6/20/99 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 14:17:47 -0500 From: Chad Maloney Subject: Re: total request live + Moxy truztno1 wrote: > > i know you guys have probably discussed this to death before i joined > this NG, but I was just thinking, wouldn't it be really kick-ass if we > got a Fruvous video (if they have one) on to MTV's total request > live? Fruvous has quite a few videos actually. There is a list of them on FDC at http://www.fruvous.com/discog.html. Now, I don't want to seem negative about the whole TRL thing, but they've tried to do this on the TMBG mailing list as well. It just seems to be completely hopeless. The winning videos get thousands of votes (though I don't believe that a thousand people can spell or even say Dabitawa or whatever the hell that Kid Rock song is) and even if we all call in a couple times and send emails, it will take a whole lot of doing. Of course deep down, I think the whole thing is rigged anyway and they just pick the videos whose record labels pay them the most money to promote the video. But, I did see (while I was watching the Real World which I watch for some stupid reason) I saw a commercial for Matt Pinfield's Indie Music Video show or something. Ok, I actually went to the MTV website and found a link: http://www.mtv.com/sendme.tin?page=/mtv/music/flying_indie/ Of course, you can't submit your own opinion, you have to choose from the opinions they have available. - Chad ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 1999 14:44:11 GMT From: srm9988n@aol.composter (Lori Martin) Subject: Re: The Vault show! (very long) Lawrence summarized: >I'd post more to this, but I can't think of what to say, and my brother >is bugging me to get off the computer (it's frickin' 3:30 in the >morning!) 3:30! 3:30 he complains about! Yeesh, at 3:30 Katester and I were still going the wrong way on 695, somewhere east of Timonium, wondering if when we got turned around we'd spot the FrüBus (is it still a FrüBus or is it now considered a FrüRig?) ... One of the best things about last night was, it proved I really still can pull off the occasional all nighter. That and, neither Kate nor I just fell off a turnip truck. (The guys in the conversion van in the parking lot no doubt wish we had, but that's another and grimmer story.) When we finally got in, sun rising over Philadelphia, Steve, already in the shower, asked "so how was the show?" And Lori, in a stupor, replied: "basement party black lights candles comfy couches Paper Moon chocolate milkshakes trace jen kim chad jess wendy alan anna lawrence dan dave david val wren randy loren ellen amanda lori chrisT kevin mindy donna sarah sarah zzzzzzzz .... " If I left you out of that montage, don't feel slighted. I'm going on only 2 hours sleep. :) More hugs to all I hugged last night. Waves to all I missed. Apologies to all I inadvertently bounced on. Fort Erie ho! - -- Lori ******************************* Lori's Strange and Wonderful World: http://members.aol.com/srm9988n/index.html Früvous/amm-f factoids galore (courtesy of Colleen Campbell): http://www.fruvous.com/news/faq.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Jun 1999 08:24:56 GMT From: jkpolk@ntplx.net (Andrea Krause) Subject: Re: huh? On Fri, 25 Jun 1999 17:03:24 EDT, Leah wrote: >Am I the only one around here who thinks that any kind of coffee, >Starbucks or otherwise is gross? Blech! I can't stand the stuff! > >Leah Coffee is wretched. (And not in the really kickass cool way that Moxy Früvous is wretched.) Unfortunately, coffee smells so good to me! I smell it, think "Mmmm, well it can't be that bad THIS time." and...well....it is. :) People say "well you have to add a lot of cream and sugar to it!" Sorry, I'm just not interested in conditioning myself to drink something that I have to disguise to make it palatable. What's the point in that? Anyway, enough ranting from me. Of course at 4:30 in the morning my idea of ranting turns out to be a petulant whine. :) Andrea - --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Moxy Früvous is a trust exercise." - Mike Ford 1/1/99 Pumpkins, Cookies, Tapes, and The Früvous Dance: http://users.ntplx.net/~jkpolk - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 23:12:08 GMT From: CheesemonkeyGem Subject: re: stanley cup lamentations - --- Jill Hufnagel wrote: i said: >i dont get it tho...whats with every female liking >this Peca kid? too much of a pretty boy type. >again, ive missed the Peca boat and im waving from the >shore... then jill said this and posted it to just me by accident so im posting it for her to the group: Oh, how can you not...I'd give anything...and aboot the stuble, I think that he looks great anyway...Stuble no stuble, glasses no glasses, dressed undressed, Hee hee hee...Well I just think he's totally swell, too bad that he's married. I cried when that happened. Plus he seems really intellegent. What can I say the man of my dreams... **jiel** and i am going to retort with: heeheehee, is aboot a mistype, or are you mocking me? or do you type it that way? hehe, i type it as "aboot," its the fun canadian stereotype! (although we pronouce it as "aboat"). anyhoo, aboot Peca... hehe, ive never seen him off the ice, (well except for those fox promo spots or whatever ya call them) so i dunoo how intelligent he is, but one things for sure, he couldnt act his way out of a paper bag! Wanna see a hockey player do some okay acting? Check out the scene in Mighty Ducks (number 1) where the kids are in the minnesota arena and Mike Modano and Basil McRae come out and talk to the kids. McRae (whos a friend of our family) is not that bad! hehe then theres modano who looks as nervous and uncomfortable as hell! - -jen the cheesemonkey === Before you get in a fight with a person, walk 500 hundred miles in his shoes. That way you're 500 hundred miles ahead of him and you've got his shoes. _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 10:18:08 -0500 From: Chad Maloney Subject: Re: The Vault show! (very long) Modnar wrote: > I'm sure there's going to be a lot of negative reaction to me giving a > poor review of the show but honestly I'm dissapointed in the new > material. Hopefully it'll grow on me like the recent Ben Folds Five disc > has which also features a much more low key and 'mature' sound than what > I was hoping for. I think you hit the nail on the head right there. All the new songs are still unmistakenly Fruvous, but they aren't rehashes of old tried and true stuff. It is gonna take a while for some people to come around to it, but I think, like Wood, this is gonna turn out to be a fan favorite. Eventually, the "different" nature of some of the newer songs will not seem so odd and fans will appreciate the complete package album like they did with Wood. Personally, I'm already enamored with the new stuff, but I can definitely understand where others are coming from, especially people whose love for Fruvous lie in Bargainville songs and Kick in the Ass. But listen hard to the new songs and Fruvous is very much there. Complex harmony is there. Great music is there. On first listen to the new BFF CD, I didn't take to it really, but I found myself listening to it over and over again. I don't understand if that means I really did like it a lot or if I just wanted myself to like it because it was Ben Folds Five. Now I like it (but still not as much as the self-titled album) and still listen to it frequently. So I dunno. But I haven't been as excited for a new album to come out as I am for Thornhill. New York City on August 10th[1]? Hmmmm. - Chad [1] Just a guess. Jian mentioned that they couldn't do the Ark Golf Event on the 7th, 8th, and 9th because they were gonna be in New York. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 14:11:18 GMT From: Modnar Subject: Re: The Vault show! (very long) Heh, its always interesting to see people that you recognize as regular posters to the TMBG mailing list. I'm a first class lurker myself. I think all told I've seen Fruvous something like 20 times and I'd have to say that this show was by far my least favorite. I think it was a combination of the knowledge I was only going to get four hours of sleep after the show and them playing (in my opinion) way too much slow stuff in large blocks. For some reason none of the new songs really grab me likt the rest of their repatoire does. They seem to fall into the blah schlock rock catagory more than anything and certainly lack the excitement of most of Bargainville or You Will Go To The Moon. I guess it's more in line with a Wood-ish kind of feel but in comparison alot of the new stuff seems kinda flat and dull. The vocals and insturmentation seems simpler, there's not really any fun songs and there seems to be a severe lack of some righteous harmonizing or anything of the sort. The opening act (some bald guy named Dave [though not THE bald guy named Dave]) was pretty damn sly though. His songs were amusing and he did some cool things with his acoustic guitar. Apparently he's in some local band called Laughing Colors though I don't know how much of his stuff was indicative to what the band plays. They've got a web site at www.laughingcolors.com where there's some tour dates and such if anyone who enjoyed his set wants to check him (them out). I'm sure there's going to be a lot of negative reaction to me giving a poor review of the show but honestly I'm dissapointed in the new material. Hopefully it'll grow on me like the recent Ben Folds Five disc has which also features a much more low key and 'mature' sound than what I was hoping for. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 15:44:38 GMT From: trace@frumail.org (Trace) Subject: The Vault- 6-24-99 Ok, Lawrence did a great job of reviewing the show, so I won't repeat the full set list, but rather give some random impressions/memories. Early in the show, Murray, who was hidden from much of the crowd because he was behind the speakers, decided to dedicate *his* show,(not *the* show mind you, just *his* show) to the people in front who couldn't see him. Jian decided to dedicate *his* show to the same people, but Murray explained that there was already a "gap" in the show because of Murray's decision, so Jian-Mike-Dave would have to fill that gap by playing to the rest of the audience. It was "Murray's People" who tried to hum along with the pitchpipe at the beginning of Moon, prompting Jian to ask Murray to talk to his "people," which resulted in the "perfect pitch" lecture. Murray later apologized to them as his people apparently ALL had perfect pitch. :) Mike commented that Dave was wearing Murray's shirt, to rousing applause. In fact, in the shirt department, Dave out-Murrayed Murray. He was wearing a shirt that was both polka-dotted AND floral. Interesting. Jian wore his "I dig your boyfriend" shirt. Murray had the rather tame bubble shirt on, and Mike was dashing in a little, pastel, blue/pink plaid number. In addition to Jian's annoyance with the crowd noise during the beginning of Psycho, I also noticed him become visibly annoyed with the never-ending chatter during the quiet moments of IWHO. He was practically rolling his eyes at them while singing. Finally, the bass-freaks (you know who you are) would've liked last night's version of Michy. The levels on the banjo bottomed out, and for most of the song, the banjo was just not there. I saw Dave playing, but couldn't hear a note. It didn't sound bad though, in the absence of banjo, Murray's bass was a dominant force through the song. I like the banjo, but it was kinda groovy with such a heavy rhythm section going. - -- Trace trace@frumail.org AMM-F: You must be this insane to ride ----- - -Veronica J Gruneberg ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 1999 14:11:07 GMT From: srm9988n@aol.composter (Lori Martin) Subject: Re: the great IWHO debate continues. ;) ellen ellen watermelon said: >what i hear is more a healer-type speaking to a wounded-bird type. >and that's not always a good, equal standing to be on in a relationship, >i admit, but it doesn't have to be wrong. This is the wonder of the song (and those of you who don't like it don't have to agree): it conveys a goodly amount of depth and ambiguity within what at first sound like standard lost-love lines. >point taken, and yes i can see this, too, although not being a parent >myself, i can't relate completely. i mostly hear it as a relationship >(between lovers) song, because some of the little tender-isms being >offered are things that are-- to me-- things a lover would do (i.e. i'll >hold the line so you can call; i'll hold the mirror so you can fix your >hair, etc). Agreed -- at first listen. But then there are the other sorts of estranged relationships (waiting for phone calls that don't come -- on Mother's Day? On a birthday? On Christmas?) There's also the potential for the helping-out aspect that one might encounter with a trying-to-be-independent loved one who for whatever reason (youth, illness, frailty?) seems to be struggling with that ability to be independent. >anyway, my point, i guess, is that i hear this as a song of reassurance >and not one of crisis. it can be both, sure-- reassurance in the face of >crisis-- but i mostly hear self-assurance and warmth in the narrator's >words, and not desperation or fear. And a patience and love that allows him to back off until he feels his presence is requested -- mixed with a commitment that says "I'm not going to bail no matter how difficult you make it." >disclaimer: this is just my reaction to the song; i know it's not what >we've all been told the song is "about," and i know a lot of people >would probably disagree with me, because, well, you're not all me. ;) And yes Ji, it *is* well established that it's a love-bordering-on-unhealthy obsession song. Too. :) It's just that subtext can be an amazing thing. >peace, >ellen (hey, i like this. what shall we deconstruct next?) Not Present Tense Tureen, 'kay? - -- Lori ***************** That's the loveliest tureen that I've ever seen It's not a tureen, it's a tureen -- a mighty confused elf, according to Lawrence ------------------------------ End of alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V3 #525 ********************************************