From: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org (alloy-digest) To: alloy-digest@smoe.org Subject: alloy-digest V7 #169 Reply-To: alloy@smoe.org Sender: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "alloy-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. alloy-digest Friday, August 23 2002 Volume 07 : Number 169 Today's Subjects: ----------------- RE: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping ["Dennis Al] RE: Alloy: ads reply 2 ["Dennis Alexander" ] Re: Alloy: ads reply 2 [PRAEst76 ] RE: Alloy: ads reply 2 ["Robin Thurlow" ] Re: Alloy: ads reply 2 [PRAEst76 ] Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! ["Keith Stansell" ] Alloy: UK UR [William Steffey ] Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! ["Melissa Jordan" ] RE: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! ["Robin Thurlow" ] Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping ["Crackers"] RE: Alloy: ads reply 2 ["Robin Thurlow" ] Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping ["Keith Sta] Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! ["Keith Stansell" ] Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping [graham stu] Re: Alloy: ads reply 2 [CJMark@aol.com] Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping [William St] Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping ["Melissa J] Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping ["Melissa J] RE: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping ["Robin Thu] RE: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping ["Melissa J] Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! ["Crackers" ] Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! [PRAEst76 Subject: RE: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping I've been wanting to publish an album of my own for years (who knows if I'll ever actually accomplish the feat), but, just curious, the RIAA doesn't collect money from artists in the US for this as well, do they? Anyone know? - -----Original Message----- From: owner-alloy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-alloy@smoe.org]On Behalf Of PRAEst76 Sent: Friday, August 16, 2002 12:09 PM To: alloy@smoe.org Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping Crackers said... > Of course it'll only be a matter of time until the RIAA buys laws that make > it illegal to self publish or laws, like they have here in Canada, that > require self publishing artists to pay the RIAA (or CRIA as it is known in > Canada) 29 cents (soon to be 53 cents) for each CD unit they self produce. Uh? So if I lived in Canada and I made an album and self-published it I would have to pay the CRIA 29c? How do they get it? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 22:54:39 -0700 From: "Dennis Alexander" Subject: RE: Alloy: ads reply 2 I have to agree with you on a lot of what you've said. However, I've seen something unusual here in Denver, Colorado that I'm not sure how to explain... We have a station here, KBCO - 97.3FM, that plays music from the 60's thru today. Their original concept was to sound like a bunch of guys sitting around in a cabin up here in Boulder, in the Colorado Rocky Mountains, just playing a lot of good music. They still (mostly) hold onto that concept. They play old, new, rock, blues, reggae, etc; a nice variety. They are indeed playing the new Elvis stuff along with Elvis Costello's and the Counting Crows, along with Bob Marley, the Grateful Dead, Jackson Browne, John Mayer, Bonnie Raitt, etc. They only play Thomas Dolby during their afternoon 80's flashback segment, but they do play him. They don't play Def Leppard, but they do play Red Hot Chili Peppers and Green Day. Usually they lean towards the more 'grown-up' side though. They just hit their 25th year and as part of the celebration, they spent 3 weeks starting with their first year and just playing a sample of the music they were playing that year. Before this, they had kinda gotten homogenized and just played what their research showed their users wanted to hear. In my mind that's a terrible formula! If you just start playing what people want to hear and not throw in all the extra songs that people (at least used to) like, things get very boring. On their station it did get boring! I think after that 3 weeks, they probably got a ton of calls saying, 'why don't you play all this good music all the time? After all, its what you advertise you do!' Now its a lot more fun to listen to. Here's the ironic thing, they are a Clear Channel station, which is a huge conglommerate of media businesses. They also own another station similar to KBCO, KTCL 93.3FM which they call their younger sister. Same format, but geared towards the younger 'alternative' crowd. While, I still see some of that restricting going on in both stations, they're suprisingly wide in their format! Maybe, they've learned that what really sells is a wide variety? Its hard to comprehend such a concept... But I still would love to start my own radio station that has no hype, sparring advertising and thats about it. They would play TMDR's 'Cloudburst..', Depeche Mode's 'Somebody', Boston's "Don't Look Back", Heart's "Dog and Butterfly", Gorilla's 'Clint Eastwood', The Ramones, Van Halen, Linkin Park, The Byrds, Massive Attack, Yes, SWV, Howard Jones, Rage Against the Machine, Enya, Joe Jackson, etc. I might even throw in some Bette Midler, and Nat King Cole just for the fun of it. I have a very wide taste spectrum to begin with, but there used to be an independed radio station that played a format like this. They got forced out of business by a pack of competing stations. They decided to hold a funeral for the station and handed out token mini-caskets to the mass of people who showed up! They can call it a Democracy, but Capitalism, creates Facism. That's not a political statement or position, just an observance. bluemeitz@cs.com said... P.S. By the way I like the record company controls the market response. Besides it being an opinion it was quite truthful. Record companies are out there mainly for their interests and giving us what they want to push upon us and squeeze out our interests. (ie. Thomas Dolby, other vintage 80's acts). When was the last time you heard the latest by Def Leppard? Counting Crows? Elvis Costello? Hmmmm? No wonder Europeans are scratching their head on why the latest track by Elvis isnt being played much here or even a top 40 hit. (Discussions on billboard.com/chartbeat chat) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 14:56:46 +0100 From: PRAEst76 Subject: Re: Alloy: ads reply 2 Dennis Alexander said... > But I still would love to start my own radio station that has no > hype, sparring advertising and thats about it. They would play > TMDR's 'Cloudburst..', Depeche Mode's 'Somebody', Boston's "Don't > Look Back", Heart's "Dog and Butterfly", Gorilla's 'Clint Eastwood', > The Ramones, Van Halen, Linkin Park, The Byrds, Massive Attack, Yes, > SWV, Howard Jones, Rage Against the Machine, Enya, Joe Jackson, etc. > I might even throw in some Bette Midler, and Nat King Cole just for > the fun of it. This is why I like online shoutcast radio stations. Anyone can set one up providing you have a bit of bandwidth and it costs very little to run it. It's s shame these are being clamped down on by large corporations supposedly reprisenting artists who don't like the idea of there being broadcasts that are out of their control. - -- PRAEst76 http://www.cancellation.freeserve.co.uk/praest76/ np: Killing Joke - Mathematics of Chaos ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 10:28:29 -0400 From: "Robin Thurlow" Subject: RE: Alloy: ads reply 2 The internet is the only way to hear decent radio these days. The same companies own almost all the radio stations around here (except for the university one, in which case you're often at the mercy of random teenagers at the controls) and it's all dismal. Maybe the commercial radio stations will pick up on what people *really* want in radio, by paying attention to the web-access stations we're tuning into most? Doubtful. They don't want to learn. Crushing those who oppose them is more efficient. ~R needing coffee ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 15:46:24 +0100 From: PRAEst76 Subject: Re: Alloy: ads reply 2 Robin Thurlow said... > The internet is the only way to hear decent radio these days. The > same companies own almost all the radio stations around here (except > for the university one, in which case you're often at the mercy of > random teenagers at the controls) and it's all dismal. I'm not sure if we have university radio here. I've never been to university and know no students that listen to radio other than that which the BBC provide. I ran a shoutcast station once... it's not very good on a dialup modem though. > Maybe the commercial radio stations will pick up on what people > *really* want in radio, by paying attention to the web-access > stations we're tuning into most? Only if there is money in it. Radio to entertain and educate isn't considered cost effective. > Doubtful. They don't want to learn. Crushing those who oppose them > is more efficient. Originally it was about giving peopel what they want, now it's about tellign them what they want and giving them that. The easiest way is to remove all opposition. Punters will be sure to buy your product if it is the ONLY product. Kinda Orwellian. Makes me sick. I'd rather buy nothing. > ~R > needing coffee I'm personally a believer in Tea. Coffee makes me (more) agitated - -- PRAEst76 http://www.cancellation.freeserve.co.uk/praest76/ np: Killing Joke - Wardance ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 10:14:07 -0600 From: "Keith Stansell" Subject: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! I'd say the music industry is in a pretty sad state right now for the listener who likes variety. I've pretty much given up listening to music on the radio and I now just tune into NPR for the news and such on my way to work. The past few years I started to conclude that there wasn't any new music out there that I liked besides the occasional Radiohead release. The real problem is that the music I liked wasn't finding me. I've recently found some "channels" that help me discover new music. Within the last year I started recording 120 Minutes on MTV2. It is two hours of alternative videos that are "just outside of the mainstream". I've found a lot of artists on there that I like that I haven't heard anywhere else - Grandaddy, The Doves, Rufus Wainwright. That has been a good source of new things I like. Strangely enough, it was that show that turned me onto a lot of alternative music I liked back in the late 80's - The Cure, XTC, Smiths... Another place I now discover new music I like is 3WK Underground Radio on the Internet : http://www.3wk.com/ They play some things I like, some I don't - and show the song and artist names as they play. They also have a 96K stream that sounds pretty good if you have a fast connection. Unfortunatley, I'm afraid online stations like that will go the way of the independent radio stations due to the high royalties just recently imposed on them. You can read more about it and how to help here: http://www.saveinternetradio.com/ Is it just me, or has the RIAA just gone crazy lately. Now they want to hack peoples computers legally? They wan't to blame decreased music sales on online trading, but I really think they should look into : 1 - Mega corporate radio blandness. 2 - Overpriced $20.00 CD's 3 - Expensive concert tickets due to out of control "service charges". 4 - Too much of the same type of music when it comes to the artist they promote - Is it just me, or did everyone sound like Creed last year? Hey Dennis, I'll have to give KBCO another listen. - -Keith Stansell Denver - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Alexander" > > They can call it a Democracy, but Capitalism, creates Facism. That's not a > political statement or position, just an observance. > > bluemeitz@cs.com said... > > P.S. By the way I like the record company controls the market response. > Besides it being an opinion it was quite truthful. Record companies are out > there mainly for their interests and giving us what they want to push upon > us and squeeze out our interests. (ie. Thomas Dolby, other vintage 80's > acts). When was the last time you heard the latest by Def Leppard? Counting > Crows? Elvis Costello? Hmmmm? No wonder Europeans are scratching their head > on why the latest track by Elvis isnt being played much here or even a top > 40 hit. (Discussions on billboard.com/chartbeat chat) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 11:12:14 -0500 From: William Steffey Subject: Alloy: UK UR There's actually a bunch of universtity radio in the UK. In London you've got CHRW (94.7), IC Radio (99.9) to name a couple. - -W >I'm not sure if we have university radio here. I've never been to >university and know no students that listen to radio other than that >which the BBC provide. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 12:30:00 -0400 From: "Melissa Jordan" Subject: Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! >>> Keith@Stansell.com 08/23/02 12:14PM >>> Is it just me, or has the RIAA just gone crazy lately. Now they want to hack peoples computers legally? They wan't to blame decreased music sales on online trading, but I really think they should look into : >1 - Mega corporate radio blandness. I pretty much only listen to the oldies station or talk radio in my car now. Just so much crap, it's frightening. Thank god there are some good Internet-available stations, so I can stay sane at work. >2 - Overpriced $20.00 CD's Yep. Outrageous - I end up buying everything second hand off of SecondSpin.com or eBay. I can't afford most new music. >3 - Expensive concert tickets due to out of control "service charges". Oh yes - some of the TicketBastard fees here in DC are now $8 and $9. It's disgusting and ridiculous. Unless Neil Finn or Michael Penn or Morrissey or Joe Jackson or such come to town, forget it. >4 - Too much of the same type of music when it comes to the artist they promote - Is it just me, or did everyone sound like Creed last year? That is so funny - I listen to songs and frankly, I have no idea if they're one band or another. I hear stuff and think, "Uh, is this Pearl Jam... or is it Stone Temple Pilots... or is it...??? And I just said the same thing about Creed & co. to someone last week. You know, in the '80's, I could sure as hell tell the difference between the bands - good, bad, and ugly. - - Melissa J. Melissa R. Jordan SABIT Standards Program Coordinator (202) 482-2086 (202) 482-2443 (fax) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 12:43:36 -0400 From: "Robin Thurlow" Subject: RE: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! Keith wwrote: :: 2 - Overpriced $20.00 CD's :: This is the sole reason why I have pretty much stopped buying CDs, except in very rare instances. They're so overpriced... and I have this haunting feeling it probably costs ten cents or something for major labels to actually create/package/ship each CD, because they're done in such bulk amounts. I'm really grateful for places like projekt.com and cdbaby.com for offering their CDs at affordable prices. There is also the option of getting the CDs used... but the used CD place I used to go to just had to close down because of the popularity of MP3. ~R ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 12:53:33 -0700 From: "Crackers" Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Alexander" > Uh? So if I lived in Canada and I made an album and self-published it I > would > have to pay the CRIA 29c? > > How do they get it? Every blank CD has a 29 cent (soon to be 53 cent) levy on it. It doesn't matter if you purchase the CDs at a Walmart or at a duplication house, you still have to pay the levy. There are no exceptions made for this levy either so if you're a musician who self publishes or a software company it doesn't matter you still have to pay the CRIA 29 cents on every CD you use to make your work. Crackers (Damn bastards from hell!!!!!) Ghastly's Ghastly Comic http://ghastly.keenspace.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 12:55:42 -0400 From: "Robin Thurlow" Subject: RE: Alloy: ads reply 2 PRAEst76 wrote: :: Originally it was about giving peopel what they want, now it's about tellign them what they want and giving them that. The easiest way is to remove all opposition. Punters will be sure to buy your product if it is the ONLY product. Kinda Orwellian. :: George definitely knew what he was talking about. I think the culture of commercialism and shoving products at us everywhere we look (I can't remember what sci-fi it was, where the advertisements were even projected into your dreams.. was it Red Dwarf?) is what drives my compulsion to learn how to make/fix as many types of things as possible. Growing up with a very limited family budget started me off on this road but the commercial culture keeps driving it. But as a result, I'm now hooked on home improvement shows. I have learned what a berm (sp?) is. Does anyone here know? :: I'm personally a believer in Tea. Coffee makes me (more) agitated :: I only drink decaf (or on really sleepy/headachey days, half-caf). I get way too tweaked on regular coffee. It's like breathing helium. At the coffee stand yesterday, I ran into the most strung-out, argumentative guy who works with me on campus, and he ordered a double espresso, loaded it with sugar, and slammed it down like an old-west cowboy downing whiskey. It made me wonder if he would be sweet and agreeable were it not for the daily caffeine overdose. The stuff was so dense it was practically solid. ~R ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 10:58:59 -0600 From: "Keith Stansell" Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping That would piss me off if I had to pay the CRIA 53 cents every time I made a backup of my hard drive. I pay less than 29 cents for a blank CD. That makes no sense at all. It presumes that people are only using CD's for illegal copying. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Crackers" To: Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 1:53 PM Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dennis Alexander" > > Uh? So if I lived in Canada and I made an album and self-published it I > > would > > have to pay the CRIA 29c? > > > > How do they get it? > > Every blank CD has a 29 cent (soon to be 53 cent) levy on it. It doesn't > matter if you purchase the CDs at a Walmart or at a duplication house, you > still have to pay the levy. There are no exceptions made for this levy > either so if you're a musician who self publishes or a software company it > doesn't matter you still have to pay the CRIA 29 cents on every CD you use > to make your work. > > Crackers > (Damn bastards from hell!!!!!) > > Ghastly's Ghastly Comic > http://ghastly.keenspace.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 11:00:41 -0600 From: "Keith Stansell" Subject: Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Melissa Jordan" > >3 - Expensive concert tickets due to out of control "service charges". > > Oh yes - some of the TicketBastard fees here in DC are now $8 and $9. It's disgusting and ridiculous. Unless Neil Finn or Michael Penn or Morrissey or Joe Jackson or such come to town, forget it. > It's even worse if you buy tickets online by credit card which makes no sense to me. I bought a Sonic Youth ticket Wednesday on TicketWeb (who I believe were bought by TicketMaster) and the service charge for a $20.00 concert ticket was $7.50 - Why so much cost for an online purchase of a ticket - there was no person involved in taking my order and I got a "will call" ticket so there was no printing or postage costs. You have to believe that TicketMaster's overall cost of operation has decreased in recent years to advancements in technology and automation - there has to be a lot less paper shuffuling for them. Plus, since they are now pretty much the only game in towns across the country, they could consolodate their call centers and reduce the number of opperators they need. I just don't get it. It has to be just plain greed coupled with a monopoly. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 13:02:09 -0400 From: graham stuart Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping on 8/23/02 12:58 PM, Keith Stansell at Keith@Stansell.com wrote: > > That would piss me off if I had to pay the CRIA 53 cents every time I made a > backup of my hard drive. I pay less than 29 cents for a blank CD. That > makes no sense at all. It presumes that people are only using CD's for > illegal copying. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Crackers" > To: > Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 1:53 PM > Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping > > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Dennis Alexander" >>> Uh? So if I lived in Canada and I made an album and self-published it I >>> would >>> have to pay the CRIA 29c? >>> >>> How do they get it? >> >> Every blank CD has a 29 cent (soon to be 53 cent) levy on it. It doesn't >> matter if you purchase the CDs at a Walmart or at a duplication house, you >> still have to pay the levy. There are no exceptions made for this levy >> either so if you're a musician who self publishes or a software company it >> doesn't matter you still have to pay the CRIA 29 cents on every CD you use >> to make your work. >> >> Crackers >> (Damn bastards from hell!!!!!) >> >> Ghastly's Ghastly Comic >> http://ghastly.keenspace.com In keeping with keith's illegal copying idea, I am looking for copies of some obscure dolby material, i would love any old fallout club, jungle line, live wireless-howard the duck even...can anyone here help? i'd be happy to make a trade ! graham please email me at graham.maureen@sympatico.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 13:07:06 EDT From: CJMark@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: ads reply 2 In a message dated 8/23/02 9:56:11 AM Pacific Daylight Time, rthurlow@binghamton.edu writes: > At the coffee stand yesterday, I ran into the most strung-out, argumentative > guy who works with me on campus, and he ordered a double espresso, loaded > it > with sugar, and slammed it down like an old-west cowboy downing whiskey. It > made me wonder if he would be sweet and agreeable were it not for the daily > caffeine overdose. The stuff was so dense it was practically solid. > Hey Robin.. I guess I have to differ with you on this.. I used to live in Italy.. where drinking a double espresso is quite normal.. about once every two hours. They load it with sugar.. and launch themselves for the first hour.. then coast the second hour before heading back to the coffee stand for another jolt. And I have to say.. as crazy as Italians might be.. they are also among the most charming people on earth in my opinion. So I think it probably depends more on the type of person they are before they hit the coffee stand. It might enhance their personality.. or at least the speed at which they present themselves to you.. but it really doesn't change someone.. at least as far as I've observed. I haven't been much of a contributor to Alloy lately. I keep reading and enjoying everyone's comments.. but I have just been so busy that it's difficult to find the extra moments in the day to actually use my brain enough to respond with any intelligence. So.. take care everyone.. and I'll be here.. lurking.. ;-D Mark (Drinking my first cup as I hit send) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 12:06:43 -0500 From: William Steffey Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping There was a similar levy waged on blank cassettes for the same reason- and I believe it's still there. And to chime in on a parallel posting- I'm a decaf guy as well. If I'm feeling really nutty, I'll have a cup of half regular / half decaf (but only if it's early in the morning.) - -W Keith Stansell wrote: >That would piss me off if I had to pay the CRIA 53 cents every time I made a >backup of my hard drive. I pay less than 29 cents for a blank CD. That >makes no sense at all. It presumes that people are only using CD's for >illegal copying. > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Crackers" >To: >Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 1:53 PM >Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping > > >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "Dennis Alexander" >> >>>Uh? So if I lived in Canada and I made an album and self-published it I >>>would >>>have to pay the CRIA 29c? >>> >>>How do they get it? >>> >>Every blank CD has a 29 cent (soon to be 53 cent) levy on it. It doesn't >>matter if you purchase the CDs at a Walmart or at a duplication house, you >>still have to pay the levy. There are no exceptions made for this levy >>either so if you're a musician who self publishes or a software company it >>doesn't matter you still have to pay the CRIA 29 cents on every CD you use >>to make your work. >> >>Crackers >>(Damn bastards from hell!!!!!) >> >>Ghastly's Ghastly Comic >>http://ghastly.keenspace.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 13:09:27 -0400 From: "Melissa Jordan" Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping >>> wcs@williamsteffey.com 08/23/02 01:06PM >>> There was a similar levy waged on blank cassettes for the same reason- and I believe it's still there. And to chime in on a parallel posting- I'm a decaf guy as well. If I'm feeling really nutty, I'll have a cup of half regular / half decaf (but only if it's early in the morning.) - -W Decaf. Arg. I've just had to decaffeinate myself recently. I was diagnosed with diabetes, unfortunately, and caffeine can spike your blood glucose. No fun. - - Melissa J. Melissa R. Jordan SABIT Standards Program Coordinator (202) 482-2086 (202) 482-2443 (fax) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 13:09:41 -0400 From: "Melissa Jordan" Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping Graham, I know you've written a couple of times, and I don't know if anyone has responded to you privately. You probably haven't received anything publicly because there is a measure of discomfort with your request. Thomas Dolby is a participant in this community, and he's not hip to the "illegal copying" you're referring to. Hence, I imagine, the silence. However, if you e-mail me, I can give you the contact info for an awesome Internet-based vinyl shop that stocks virtually all the stuff you mentioned, save Live Wireless, which is available on eBay quite often. Hope that helps! - - Melissa J. Melissa R. Jordan SABIT Standards Program Coordinator (202) 482-2086 (202) 482-2443 (fax) >>> graham.maureen@sympatico.ca 08/23/02 01:02PM >>> on 8/23/02 12:58 PM, Keith Stansell at Keith@Stansell.com wrote: > > That would piss me off if I had to pay the CRIA 53 cents every time I made a > backup of my hard drive. I pay less than 29 cents for a blank CD. That > makes no sense at all. It presumes that people are only using CD's for > illegal copying. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Crackers" > To: > Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 1:53 PM > Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping > > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Dennis Alexander" >>> Uh? So if I lived in Canada and I made an album and self-published it I >>> would >>> have to pay the CRIA 29c? >>> >>> How do they get it? >> >> Every blank CD has a 29 cent (soon to be 53 cent) levy on it. It doesn't >> matter if you purchase the CDs at a Walmart or at a duplication house, you >> still have to pay the levy. There are no exceptions made for this levy >> either so if you're a musician who self publishes or a software company it >> doesn't matter you still have to pay the CRIA 29 cents on every CD you use >> to make your work. >> >> Crackers >> (Damn bastards from hell!!!!!) >> >> Ghastly's Ghastly Comic >> http://ghastly.keenspace.com In keeping with keith's illegal copying idea, I am looking for copies of some obscure dolby material, i would love any old fallout club, jungle line, live wireless-howard the duck even...can anyone here help? i'd be happy to make a trade ! graham please email me at graham.maureen@sympatico.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 13:33:29 -0400 From: "Robin Thurlow" Subject: RE: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping Melissa wrote: :: Decaf. Arg. I've just had to decaffeinate myself recently. I was diagnosed with diabetes, unfortunately, and caffeine can spike your blood glucose. No fun. :: Did you have to endure the caffeine withdrawal headaches? I remember those from when I gave it up. The migraine meds I take are packed with caffeine, so I assume there may be an across-the-board headache connection, somehow. I hope you're feeling well, and have been getting medical advice from doctors you find extremely trustworthy on this subject! xx ~R ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 13:42:15 -0400 From: "Melissa Jordan" Subject: RE: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping Melissa R. Jordan SABIT Standards Program Coordinator (202) 482-2086 (202) 482-2443 (fax) >>> rthurlow@binghamton.edu 08/23/02 01:33PM >>> >>Did you have to endure the caffeine withdrawal headaches? I remember those from when I gave it up. The migraine meds I take are packed with caffeine, so I assume there may be an across-the-board headache connection, somehow. You know, strangely - no headaches at all. I went cold turkey on caffeine and refined sugars, and I don't miss them. (I can't stand decaf coffee or decaf diet Coke though - yuck.) >>I hope you're feeling well, and have been getting medical advice from doctors you find extremely trustworthy on this subject! Thanks, Robin. Lots of appointments with lots of doctors. And a lot of anxiety and sadness... But I have really good doctors now, thank god. I think some of the management in my office is irritated by how much time I've had to take off for various appointments, but screw 'em. I need my feet and my eyes and my kidneys a lot more than I need to work for them. Cheers, Melissa ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 14:48:41 -0700 From: "Crackers" Subject: Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Thurlow" .> This is the sole reason why I have pretty much stopped buying CDs, except in > very rare instances. They're so overpriced... and I have this haunting > feeling it probably costs ten cents or something for major labels to > actually create/package/ship each CD, because they're done in such bulk > amounts. I'm really grateful for places like projekt.com and cdbaby.com for > offering their CDs at affordable prices. Of course it could be worse. In Japan the average CD is almost $40. The thing about over priced CDs that gets me is the cheapness of cassette tapes. A band sells a CD for $20 and the same album on cassette sells for $10 even though it costs the record company twice as much to produce an album on cassette. As for used CDs enjoy them while you can. If the RIAA gets their way those will be illegal too. Crackers (Money grubbing bastards) Ghastly's Ghastly Comic http://ghastly.keenspace.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 17:27:29 +0100 From: PRAEst76 Subject: Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! Keith Stansell said... > Is it just me, or has the RIAA just gone crazy lately. Now they want > to hack peoples computers legally? I trhink that's just America... wanting to be able to do whatever they like and be excempt from prosecution like everyone else because they are American and as such 'the good guys'. - -- PRAEst76 http://www.cancellation.freeserve.co.uk/praest76/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 18:00:40 +0100 From: PRAEst76 Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping Crackers said... > > Uh? So if I lived in Canada and I made an album and self-published > > it I would > > have to pay the CRIA 29c? > > How do they get it? > Every blank CD has a 29 cent (soon to be 53 cent) levy on it. It > doesn't matter if you purchase the CDs at a Walmart or at a > duplication house, you still have to pay the levy. I know peopel in the US/Canada who pay considerably less than 29cents for a blank CD. > There are no > exceptions made for this levy either so if you're a musician who self > publishes or a software company it doesn't matter you still have to > pay the CRIA 29 cents on every CD you use to make your work. How do they justify this? If they eliminate 95% of piracy through some miracle means would they stop taking this levy? I think these things og on becuase hte majority of peopel aren't awareo f it. Perhaps if they were made awareo f it they might kick up a stink, but probably not. I found most poeple don't stand up to bullying. Are there versions of this in other countries? Am I paying a levy on blank CDs I buy in the UK? - -- PRAEst76 http://www.cancellation.freeserve.co.uk/praest76/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 18:10:32 +0100 From: PRAEst76 Subject: Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! Melissa Jordan said... > >2 - Overpriced $20.00 CD's > > Yep. Outrageous - I end up buying everything second hand off of > SecondSpin.com or eBay. I can't afford most new music. Ebay is my friend. I haven't bought a new CD in a long time. I'm a minimum wage worker. We aren't considered valued customers. Saying that I rarely buy CDs from Ebay. Not if there is lovely beautiful vinyl available. > >3 - Expensive concert tickets due to out of control "service > > charges". > Oh yes - some of the TicketBastard fees here in DC are now $8 and $9. > It's disgusting and ridiculous. Unless Neil Finn or Michael Penn or > Morrissey or Joe Jackson or such come to town, forget it. 'And to think, Smithers... you laughed when I bought TicketMaster. "Nobody's going to pay a 100% service charge."' - Mr Burns - -- PRAEst76 http://www.cancellation.freeserve.co.uk/praest76/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 19:51:03 +0100 From: PRAEst76 Subject: Re: Alloy: RIAArrrrgggg! Crackers said... > The thing about over priced CDs that gets me is the cheapness of > cassette tapes. A band sells a CD for $20 and the same album on > cassette sells for $10 even though it costs the record company twice > as much to produce an album on cassette. I didn't even know bands where still producing cassettes? Usually I see albums released just on CD, maybe with a limited LP for the handcore vinyl junkies. I don't see Cassettes on release information. Infact I don't see them for sale anywhere except in some second hand stores and pawn shops. > As for used CDs enjoy them while you can. If the RIAA gets their way > those will be illegal too. Very true, and if the album yo uwant is deleted... well you'll have to buy something current which will ultimately be top 40 stuff only in their vision (and all artists on the main 5 majors) - -- PRAEst76 http://www.cancellation.freeserve.co.uk/praest76/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 15:26:08 -0700 From: "Crackers" Subject: Re: Alloy: U.S. Congressmen Want to Stop Online Song-Swapping - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keith Stansell" > That would piss me off if I had to pay the CRIA 53 cents every time I made a > backup of my hard drive. I pay less than 29 cents for a blank CD. That > makes no sense at all. It presumes that people are only using CD's for > illegal copying. Unfortunately the politician they've sold this little plan to is one of the stupidest, most clueless politicians in Canada. Her only real talent is riding her father's fame and name which is why she keeps getting elected. Shelia Copps is a complete menace as Heritage Minister, a job that makes her directly responsible for protecting Canadian artists but all she has been doing is selling them out to the CRIA. The CRIA showed her a chart that demonstrated the growth of blank CD sales since 1990 and music CD sales. Both show continual growth. Music CD sales are still rising and at a rather steady rate. Blank CD sales grew very slowly over the first half of the 90s then started to skyrocket in the last half. The CRIA claimed it was proof indisputable that blank CDs are being used for music piracy because their sales are growing faster than music CDs. What they didn't tell her is that in 1990 a single speed CD burner cost $2000 cnd and that a blank CD cost $80 cnd. In 1995 a single speed CD burner cost $1000 cnd and a blank CD cost $40 cnd. In 1997 a double speed CD burner cost $400 cnd and a blank CD cost $5 cnd. In 2000 a 6 speed CD burner cost $300 cnd and a blank CD cost only $1 cnd. That is why the sales of blank CDs have been skyrocketing. They were prohibitavely expensive when the 90s started, and then dirt cheap when the 90s ended. Why wouldn't you buy a CD burner for you computer if for nothing else other than data backup. I have an old HP tape backup unit sitting on a shelf. I pulled it from my computer when I bought my CD burner. Why pay $20 a tape when I can back up to CD for $1 each? Of all my CDs four are currently used to hold MP3s (which have all been ripped from CDs I already own) the rest is all computer data. Where my wife works (for a medical research group) they go through hundreds of blank CDs each and every month. Not one of their CDs contain MP3s. It all back up of reseach related data. Then there's the simple unconstitutional aspect of the blank CD levy. It assumes that anyone with a CD burner and anyone who buys a blank CD is guilty of piracy. Under the constitution of Canada we have the right to be presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. This levy is simply unconstitutional. I had sent a letter to Ms. Copps explaining all this too her and she sent me back an extremely condescending response telling me that my concerns were meaningless and that as a musician I should be applauding her because her levy is in my best interests. As for the money I spend on blank CDs to produce my own works she said not to worry, when I get signed to a record deal with a CRIA member I'll get that money back. What a joke! She is so damned clueless. She has no business being put in a position of responsibility for the rights of Canadian artists. One of my other favorite blunders of Shelia Copps took place a few years ago at the Juno awards (Canadian version of the Grammys). I have a friend named Chris Brisco who is a local music promoter. He's also black. After the Junos there was a big wrap party and of course Shelia Copps used it as an opportunity to shmooze. She comes in late and things are winding down and Chris is the only black person in the room. She walks right up to him, doesn't find out who he is or anything and shakes his hand and says to him "Congratulations for winning the Juno for 'Best Rap Artist'." Now granted, apart from being a music promoter, Chris is also a very talented musician and performer himself, but he's not a Rapper. Ms. Copps is so out of touch with the arts community that she simply assumed that anyone in a room full of music industry people who is black must be a Rapper. In her mind that assumption was as logical as assumption that the massive increase in sales of blank CDs must be responsible for music CDs not experiencing the same massive increase (music CDs of course experiencing a slow but steady increase). Crackers (Clueless bimbo from hell!!!!) Ghastly's Ghastly Comic http://ghastly.keenspace.com ------------------------------ End of alloy-digest V7 #169 ***************************