From: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org (alloy-digest) To: alloy-digest@smoe.org Subject: alloy-digest V5 #304 Reply-To: alloy@smoe.org Sender: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "alloy-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. alloy-digest Wednesday, December 20 2000 Volume 05 : Number 304 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Alloy: napster and nina [mde@stanfordalumni.org] Re: Alloy: Fifth Element [Robyn Moore ] Re: Alloy: napster and nina ["Tim Hudson" ] Alloy: Make that at least two of us ["Julie Sweeney" ] Re: Alloy: Napster [Robin Thurlow ] Alloy: speaking of music/internet distribution... [Robin Thurlow Subject: Re: Alloy: Fifth Element At 10:50 2000.12.18, you wrote: >I've never been to napster but this does not surprise me a bit. If they >can't even give proper credit to the artists they're abusing, that's >*really* the pits!! A few months ago I read an interview with the kid >who runs napster & he seemed... well... pretty oblivious about reality >to put it mildly. The interview had to do with the ruling about >MP3.com, and how it would affect napster. This is why I was hoping >they'd be gone by now. Any news to this effect in sight? Actually, they've gone into partnership with Bertelsmann, the owner of BMG Music. They're looking at morphing into a membership based system which will provide payments to artists and the companies they're beholden to. The press release can be found at - http://www.dealinfo.com/BeCG-Napster/ At the risk of once again proving that I'm out of step with the list at large, I've always been pro-Napster. I find it tremendously handy for finding tracks from out-of-print, hard-to-find or foreign albums. I would prefer systems that bypass the bureaucracy and give the money directly to the artist, but those are still hard to find and tend to work on the honor system at this point. Also, given that this, from what I've read, has been the best year for CD sales ever , the claims of overwhelming damage to 'the system' have been greatly exaggerated. Aside from that, artists can hardly be ripped-off any more by Napster and similar programs than they already are by the record companies. For an artist's viewpoint on this, check out the transcript of a speech Courtney Love gave earlier this year at - http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/2000/06/14/love/index.html I do agree that the least that could be done is correct attribution. This can be a particular problem in certain cases like Weird Al, whose stock in trade is family-friendly entertainment, when they get their name attached to something incredibly inappropriate. In fact, Al has said mis-attribution is his main problem with these sort of programs. However, some mis-attribution cases are deliberate attempts to drive Napster and similar programs out of business by putting unreliable information into the system. The favourite targets for this are the hot new ultra-popular tunes. It's not going to work, but it does provide an annoyance factor. At any rate, I'd best wrap this up. This has been a test of the Alloy Dissention System. You may now return to your regular programming. ;) Robyn M @ Robyn Moore @ http://www.wiccans.net/robyn.html @ You knew the job was dangerous when you took it. - S.C. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 10:38:58 +0000 From: "Tim Hudson" Subject: Re: Alloy: napster and nina Hi, The german text means "You stole my heart". Tim in Luxembourg City a few miles from the German frontier. - -- Tim Hudson tim_hudson@zdnetonebox.com - email ___________________________________________________________________ To get your own FREE ZDNet Onebox - FREE voicemail, email, and fax, all in one place - sign up today at http://www.zdnetonebox.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 08:28:12 -0600 From: "Julie Sweeney" Subject: Alloy: Make that at least two of us Another cogent analysis from Elaine, who is not at all despised... This is so level-headed I have nothing else to add to it... off to visit www.f---edcompany.com for pure entertainment. Avoiding the hype bandwagon at all costs-- Julie ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 19:18:16 -0800 (PST) > From: Elaine Linstruth > Subject: Alloy: More reasons to despise Elaine > > I'm sure we're all agreed that blatant outright theft of anything is not > kosher at all. MP3 files are hard to enjoy from the grace of your 2x3" > computer speakers whilst sitting in a chair in front of the New Boob Tube, > to be sure. I will, however, give Napster a tiny bit of credit -- because > I'm not sure the company is portrayed in a practical way a lot of the > time. For starters, I agree with Keith, they are never gonna make it as a > viable company (dot-com or otherwise). Secondly, the proverbial cat is > out of the bag, so the word "Napster" is kinda moot in my opinion. The > phenomenon is all over the place. This *might* turn out to be a good > thing, if you can try and put early-80's video age in the same context. > Third, (again agreeing with Keith) the quality of stuff is spotty at best. > Horrible transfer bitrates, songs cut off prematurely, misnamed songs, > mislabeled artists, you name it. These are things that don't apply in a > logical way to any conclusion that "Napster is evil." > > Essentially, Napster isn't a Player and probably never will be. If and > when they start charging or advertising, the first people there will turn > tail and run, exclaiming, "Sellout!" And that'll be the end of it. > > There are two good things though, about the philosophy, anyway (in my > opinion.) One is that the people who love their music share it with other > people that haven't heard it. Personally I don't "rip" and share any of > Thomas's stuff (or anyone else's) so don't rake me over the coals. Don't > rake me about that, anyway. The people who do share files typically got > them FROM Napster, therefore it's (see paragraph 1). The other thing > that's good is that you can get a taste for someone you've heard of, > before buying them. Now you can say I'm stealing, but it isn't any > different to me than borrowing some friend's CD before buying it myself. > Especially since said audio file is likely to have about as much sound > quality as my junior-high school friends' home made cassettes used to. > > I've done this with Eddi Reader, William Orbit, and Dan Hicks. These are > three artists whom I'm sure I never would have even heard of were it not > for Alloyeds and Thomas. I've bought Eddi, and William, and four (!) > Wendy & Lisa CD's, but alas I didn't connect with Dan. But see what I > mean? I have also gotten old air-television soundbites that I remembered, > and stuff that was off radio (that someone recorded and put out there). > > The bottom line is, to me, don't knock Napster for what their users do (to > quote yet again) and don't think everyone who Napsters is out for theft > and malice. > > This PSA is over.......returning you to your conversations. > > Elaine > sayin' what at least one of you surely must be thinkin' ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 10:10:49 -0500 From: "Ian Gifford" Subject: Alloy: MP3 companies....[ot] Hi all, Interesting stuff (about dead and dying e-business etc.) I have been spending much time researching all of the possibilities for making music available on the web. I had napster and downloaded only one song as any others that I tried were tooo slow or not responding. It was a pain in the mouse to be sure. I have been spending most of my time uploading some new tunes to MP3.com and there is no doubt in my mind that they are the best on the web right now. Did you know that David Bowie has some Live stuff on MP3.com for Streaming only?? In less than a week he had accumulated over $5000 dollars in royalties payable by MP3.com for just having his stuff streamed fromthe site. Madonna and many others are also joining in!! I put a friends tunes up (www.mp3.com/2dollarbill) and the response is fair (he made about $1.08 so far). I have put my own tunes there and am waiting for that first $1.08 So essentially my music is there to be given away for free. If enough people want it I will make money, free and clear of debt to any company. When I have a few more songs available, I will be able to allow MP3.com to sell my music through the site. MP3.com will Burn the CD, send it to people and give me 50% of whatever they see it for. I can even put my own artwork there!! I think that this is a revolutionary new thing and am glad to see so many cool musicians taking advantage of it. There are groups I have never heard of that have already made $34,000 through them... JUST IN PLAYBACK ROYALTIES!!! That does not include the fact that they can even sell there own CD's independant of MP#.com. So... If you are interested... check out what I have been able to do. First, my new site is http://www.iangifford.f2s.com I framed my site and made my mp3.com site match my own pages... you can go to the MP#.com pages directly here ---> http://www.mp3.com/IanGifford If any other musicians among us have found any similar MP3 sites, please let me know. Peace to all and the best of the season to you, Ian Gifford _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 10:34:28 -0500 From: Robin Thurlow Subject: Re: Alloy: Napster I know there are quite a few artists who don't mind napster, but there are just as many who do, and to me the artist should have the last word about how his or her work is distributed.. I know the record companies are also flinging artists' rights and opinions about their work to the winds but that doesn't mean it's right to do so, not by a long shot. The final word on anything should be the artists' own, and last time I checked, no still means no when it comes to personal rights. Any artist who doesn't want their work reproduced on the net without gaining revenue should have their wishes respected without question. The artists who think it's cool and don't see any harm in it can go ahead and have their work featured. Don't you think people should have a say in where their work goes? Music is one of those things people feel so personally about, they tend to think of it as their own. But think of it in a different context, for instance publishing. You're trying to sell a collection of short stories you've been working on painstakingly for years, gotten a publisher etc... meanwhile someone you didn't give permission to is giving the stories away one by one at a roadside stand down the street, & they won't stop. There is no difference between giving away music and giving away anything else that someone makes and is trying to earn a living at. Like I say, a lot of artists don't mind... but a lot of artists *do*. Robin T ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 13:05:07 -0500 From: Robin Thurlow Subject: Alloy: speaking of music/internet distribution... I've come across a news item I though might be of interest to some of the musicians here... Robin T 'Artists in the Digital Age' Juried Contest Sponsored by Music Player Network And Spruce Convergence Services a Division of Spruce Technologies SILICON VALLEY, Dec. 19 /PRNewswire/ -- Now bands, artists, and musician/songwriters can collaborate to showcase their talents for a chance to win $150,000 in professional production services. "Artists in the Digital Age" is a juried contest co-sponsored by Music Player Network, a property of United Entertainment Media, Inc., and Spruce Convergence Services (SCS), a division of Spruce Technologies, Inc. Contestants will combine their music with video and Web connectivity to create their own DVDonCD(TM) title using SpruceUp(TM) personal DVD authoring software, provided free by Spruce Technologies. Deadline for contest entries is March 1, 2001. The contest winner will receive professional production services valued at $150,000. -- Five days in a world-class recording studio -- Complete multi-camera, multi-angle video production -- High-end digital video post-production -- Full high-end Website development and hosting, and an ecommerce storefront -- Replication and fulfillment with 1000 complementary DVDonCD(TM) copies -- A one-year Internet distribution contract Judging will be provided by Grammy and Academy award winning producers. Vernon Black, IceBlack Productions, is a renowned musician/composer and producer whose credits include award-winning collaborations with Mariah Carey, Celine Dion, Gladys Knight, the Spice Girls and many other top performers, resulting in Gold and Platinum records. Producer, composer and performer Narada Michael Walden has won Grammy Awards for: Album of the Year ("The Bodyguard" Soundtrack, 1993); Producer of the Year (1987); and Song of the Year ("Freeway of Love" by Aretha Franklin, 1985); and an Emmy award for Whitney Houston's "One Moment in Time" for the 1988 Olympics. Peter Michael Escovedo III is a renowned musician, songwriter and producer. TV production credits include "Motown Live," with Celine Dion, B.B. King, Brandy, 98 Degrees and Peabo Bryson; and "Vibe," with Herbie Hancock, Lou Rawls, James Brown and Tower of Power. Escovedo has produced recordings for Kenny Loggins, Santana and Barbara Striesand; video tracks for Elton John and George Michael; and film soundtracks including "The Preacher's Wife" with Whitney Houston, and "Jack" with Robin Williams. Entries will be judged for their degree of excellence in three categories: AUDIO -- Composition, Originality and Performance VIDEO -- Composition, Originality and Performance INTERNET -- Integration and Composition "'Artists in the Digital Age' demonstrates the power of new enabling technologies and resources to bring the music industry to new levels of creative expression and ecommerce opportunities virtually overnight," said Paul Gallo, CEO of Music Player Network. "SCS contributes a rare combination of expertise in technology and entertainment asset production to this remarkable new project." "For the aspiring artist, this contest is an unprecedented opportunity to receive professional guidance and support for title creation, production, replication, distribution and online marketing," said Dave Tinsley, Director, Spruce Convergence Services. "Music Player Network is an ideal partner as the leading provider of print and online educational content and resources serving the entire music community." The Music Industry Paradigm Shift Contestants can visit the Music Player Network website http://www.musicplayer.com to participate and receive a FREE version of IceBlack Productions' Paradigm Shift DVDonCD. Paradigm Shift provides contestants with a real-world example of the convergence of music with video and Web-connectivity. Paradigm Shift also includes a FREE copy of SpruceUp from Spruce Technologies. (Special Contest Edition of SpruceUp automatically provides for two exports. Please allow 2-3 weeks for shipment). Backbeat Books will sponsor ten runner-up prizes. Included are: Howard Massey's Behind the Glass, in which top producers share hit-making techniques and anecdotes about working with popular music's biggest stars; and music industry veteran Moses Avalon's Confessions of a Record Producer, which tells how to protect your rights and assets and avoid pitfalls of budget tapping, song stealing and royalty skimming in order to succeed. Backbeat Books is a property of United Entertainment Media, Inc. (http://www.backbeatbooks.com). About Music Player Network The Music Player Network delivers targeted information, essential education and critical resources to the entire music community in print and on the Internet. Music Player Network is the world's most powerful direct-to-musician marketing resource. Best-selling print magazines include Guitar Player, Bass Player, Keyboard, Gig, MC2, EQ, Extreme Groove as well as annual Buyer's Guides. Through its premier Internet portal, MusicPlayer.com, the Music Player Network provides a gateway to musician services such as exclusive educational content, auction services and rich media extensions of the print properties. MusicPlayer.com and Music Player Network are properties of United News & Media, plc. For more information, visit Music Player Network at http://www.musicplayer.com or call 650-513-4300. About Spruce Convergence Services (SCS) SCS is a division of Spruce Technologies, Inc., the market leader in new media authoring solutions and services. SCS delivers broadcast-quality, Web-interactive offline broadband content-on both CD and DVD packaged media. The WIN4ALL(TM) integrated service model leverages Spruce's best-selling DVD authoring solutions and an extensive VLAN server infrastructure to deliver professional services from project consulting, hosting, data acquisition, administration, e-commerce and streaming media to Web-design and production. Only SCS delivers picture-perfect MPEG 1 and MPEG 2 full-screen imagery; pristine MPEG and AC3-Dolby digital audio on multiple tracks; Web-interactivity with full duplex communication; DVD, WebDVD and DVDonCD(TM) transportability on PCs and DVD players; and real-time interactivity with multi-angle video and menu-driven random access. WIN4ALL enables artists, producers and advertisers to improve entertainment assets, expand market reach, and capture greater customer value. For information, visit http://www.sprucetechnologies.com or call 408-861-2200. NOTE: SpruceUp, WIN4ALL, DVDonCD, and Convergence are trademarks of Spruce Technologies, Inc. All other company or product names are trademarks of their respective owners. ------------------------------ End of alloy-digest V5 #304 ***************************