Amen, Morley, and everyone, but you're missing the point. For the umpteenth time, it's NOT "look how terrible it is, poor pitiful me, bla bla bla." Look, fuck that. I did find my own solution and that meant living in my car for two years. And anyone who thinks Wendie or Bruce just sat around whining instead of working needs to have their head examined. We're the fricking people that are putting all these "how do we do it now" theories into practice. So if it seems like I'm getting a little steamed about this thread, that's why. What we ARE saying -- having gone out there and scoped things as it were -- is the brave new world we live in requires that audiences step up to the plate as well. Lip service to how great indie music is and wouldn't it be nice and keep it up just don't cut it. The labels aren't the middleman anymore, and if musicians are gonna DIY the audiences gotta meet 'em halfway. Ya gotta go to the shows, find the bands, buy the CDs or it ain't gonna work. Btw, message boards like Audities are invaluable in that regard. So I say, go Audities. Carl -- that was a beautiful post. adam marsland << I'd much rather hear Ryan's ideas then recycling The "Let me tell you how bad it is out there" That conversation was old in the 80's and now nearly 25 years later Isn't it a about time to line up with new models of possibilities?? Heck Not Lame is a great example Duet To it >>