Well, let me chime in here.  I'll match my DIY credentials with anybody on 
the planet.

Wendie and I have differed on this general topic before, and I still hate 
major labels enough to not want to sign with them unless I was doing something 
very cynical, but I have to side with her on this.  There ARE a lot of bands out 
there making it on their own but with a few exceptions they are people who 
are milking a fan base and notoriety acquired on a label.  Aimee Mann's manager 
acknowledged as much on an interview with NPR last week.

It's also worth noting that a significant number of the DIY bands that have 
made it without a label are jam bands, who themselves are working off a fan 
base created by their major label predecessors the Grateful Dead.

It's misleading to talk about being in it for money as a primary goal.  Money 
isn't the reason a lot of us do it, but money IS important, even trying to 
maintain a small, cult fan base.  You can't do even minimum promotion to get the 
album out there so that fans can find it without a substantial amount of 
cash, which usually is not going to be covered by the amount of CDs you are going 
to sell to an indie crowd.  Hell, just sending one CD out to anybody costs 
more than a buck, and that's on top of pressing costs, etc.  And with a huge 
amount of bands competing for a diminishing amount of music listeners, it's very 
difficult for that music to "[find] its way into the hands of people who enjoy 
it," without an outlay of funds, no matter what level you operate on. 

So there ya go.  Bruce?
adam marsland

<<Its called DIY.  Do It Yourself.  I have a tremendous amount of respect

for anyone who writes music and works to get it out there (your included

in that Wendie).  Obviously, you've had the experience of fighting the

uphill battle.  But in my opinion, you've already "made it."  Just wish

you and other artists would see it that way too.>>

<<Kevin wrote:

>NONE of

> the bands I listen to need major labels.  They get

> their publicity from

> creative internet ventures or word of mouth (music

> lists) or small

> labels (not lame, etc).  The "larger" acts I listen

> to want nothing to

> do with the major labels really anymore (Pearl Jam,

> Aimee Mann, Ben

> Folds).  Some would argue that without the big

> labels, those bands

> wouldn't be in a position to succeed now without

> them, but I contend

> these bands would have made it on their own anyway.


How, pray tell, do you contend "these bands would have made it on their own 
anyway"?  Really, I want to know.  I've been trying to "make it on my own" for 
years now, - with the help of an indie label or two and all by my lil' ol' 
self - and my direct experience is that it takes A LOT OF MONEY to create a 
career like those artists you mention -- for promotion and awareness and tv 
appearances and ads in Billboard and payola to the radio stations (which all the 
artistss you quote above had at a critical points in their careers) to "make it" 
in this business, money that I don't have, that the indie labels didn't have 
quite enough of, and that only major labels seem to feel inclined to dish out, 
strings, warts and all.  I'm sure your own CD collection can attest to the fact 
that "making it" has nothing to do with "talent", right?  So, if your 
definition of "making it" is at all similar to mine: i.e., being supported 
financially by one's career to the point that one doesn't have to work

 another job (isn't this the definition of anyone's life -- having your 
life's work support your LIFE?), i.e., not a weekend-warrior or emphatic hobbyist 
releasing disks on a shoestriing as in your first two sentences above (neither 
are bad, just not my definition of "making it" as an artist and I'll bet you 
none of those band's definitions either -- ask Bruce how many CDs a typical Not 
Lame band can expect to sell), then please do tell me the magic formula that 
Aimee Mann, Ben Folds and Pearl Jam could have used early in their careers 
without being on a major label first, to routinely sell 100+ thousand copies of 
whatever they feel like putting out now.

 

Inquiring minds want to know.

 

Frankly, all this hoo-ha about how fucked up the majors are (and they are, 
yes they are, but so what - any artist who's lucky enough to get signed to a 
major should know enough to take the money and run and be glad they now have a 
bankrolled shot at a future with or without the label), gets me wondering where 
the hell the next generation of musicians who grew up listening to Pearl Jam, 
Aimee Mann and Ben Folds are going to turn to follow their dreams of "making 
it" as a musician/artist.  It's practically an out-moded job description for 
non-ultra-commercial artists, now, isn't it?  To me, that's far more fucked up 
than CDs that won't play in your computers.

 

Wendie>>